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Some days I can't tell if Zed Shaw is pushing the technical community forward, or just trolling for the lulz.
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Andy Dustman's profile photoJeff Forcier's profile photoBrian Curtin's profile photoNoah Kantrowitz's profile photo
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Can't it be both? (and what is it this time?)
 
I guess this means his honeymoon with 0MQ is over, huh.

I noticed this protocol makes use of a DJB-derived format, and it made me realize, Zed is kind of our generation's DJB. Really smart/talented, but paired with some really strict opinions and a "fuck all y'all, I'm going to do this _right_" attitude.

For better or worse :)
 
Yeah, thats an apt comparison, and unfortunately I would say that much of djb's software has done more harm than good over the long term. Gotta respect his skills and balls-of-steel though.
 
Can you elaborate on that? I've always found that DJB's stuff is generally pretty solid, and in some cases (like djbdns) pretty clearly "better" (for the basic/general use case) than what came before.

His software is coupled with his bizarre notions about packaging/distribution/filesystem layout, which makes it a PITA to deploy sometimes, but that aside I didn't get the sense that eg qmail and djbdns were hurtful.
 
While qmail and djbdns were improvements over sendmail and bind, his attitudes toward accepting patches left them, IMO, much more stagnant than they could have been. Being 50% meant that they got most of the mind share for a while (thankfully postfix emerged as an alternative soon after), so the community was in a position to be dependent on software that wasn't evolving well, which seems bad to me. I guess it is hard to call something "hurtful" on the basis of a what-if, but the whole thing just rubs me the wrong way.</neckbeard>
 
Oh, and there is also his general unwillingness to manage projects. How many forks of djbdns exist now that are all still named "djbdns"?
 
Yea, his project management was terrible.

I would argue that well, it's open source, and people did/will pick up things when they're obviously abandoned -- but I recall he was not the best at "signing off" and/or ensuring that licensing/etc was in order, which probably hurt that process a lot.
 
DJB is a bane on proper software writing and maintenance. Qmail for example is a pain in the ass the manage last I had to look at it. With sendmail and/or postfix you could easily reconstruct a single mail by reading the log files, qmail just had shitty logging.
The code in itself used magical values left and right and was not maintainable at all.
To me DJB software equals bad coding practices.
 
qmail's logging is not "shitty". It's just not designed to be read by humans, but instead by scripts, or mathematicians.

All of DJB's code (at least qmail and djbdns) has been put in public domain for a few years now. He refused to license it in the sense that most people were used to because it was his position that you didn't need a license to download the software, or run it, or modify it, or to distribute the unmodified source (the latter he gave explicit permission to do). I guess he finally got tired of dealing with people complaining about the non-license-license, or needed to spend time on other things, like cryptographic research.

His code is very dense, and is often hard to understand, unless you are a compiler or a mathematician.
 
I prefer bencode to TNetstrings, and I prefer +Bram Cohen to DJB... but there's probably not actually any connection between those two facts ;)
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