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- I think Canonical made the right decision. Wayland simply is not fitting her bill. That is all that there is to it.
I really do not understand why that should provoke so much hate. I think competition is fine, but it should not lead to such bitter arguments. Linux is about diversity, and Ubuntu is on a different path than most other distro's.
I am glad they chose to go for Mir, as this gives them more control over their development process. It would be absurd to wait for Wayland to become what Ubuntu needs. Let's not forget that Canonical expected to ship Wayland two years ago. No company can plan development and production waiting for a part to maybe or not arrive. Projects like Gnome and Wayland do fine but are way to slow and run by people who have a different agenda than Canonical which is logical and perfectly fine.
Though people are now blaming Canonical to switch to Mir, the same people would blame Canonical even more if they would steer Wayland in their direction. They would accuse Canonical of hijacking Wayland. So Canonical did the only sensible thing and that is to choose another route. For years Canonical was accused for contributing to little upstream, now they will.
Whether Canonical can pull it off is their business, but I have full confidence. Canonical has a very good track record in delivering on schedule. I think what they are trying to do is very exiting and will create a necessary extension form the desktop to mobile devices. The desktop may not be so important in the future as it is now, as lots op people are moving to mobile devices.
Seeing what MS is trying to do it would be a fatal error for Linux not to develop the same kind of integration. I think it is very exiting that we can develop applications for cross platform. Mir will be able to use existing mobile drivers which is great, as drivers is often an issue and I think that Canonical might very well try to make the driver support for the Desktop in such a way that Wayland can use it too.
What I dislike about the Linux community is these over-emotional tirades without any attempt to see other peoples take on the matter. Linux is about freedom of choice. Freedom of Choice is a dead letter if you do not allow others to deviate. I think these destructive comments do more harm than good.
Mar 21, 2013
It is perfectly normal to cooperate until the decision to break is irreversible. Why would you risk troubling relations by uttering doubts. That is not how companies go about.
"The tantalizing possiblity of having a single graphics API"? Since when is it a tantalizing idea to have one of anything in Linux. Linux is about choice and let the solution win by being adopted. Free market. You ideas would fit Apple or MS, not Linux.
The thing is that Linux developers often regard their projects as babies. I can understand the deep disappointment of losing the support of Canonical. But please lets be a little professional about this.
All these accusations of Canonical trying to falsely blame Wayland. The remarks were not aired by Canonical but by people who are looking for any material that can burn and be used against Canonical. It is all so childish, so immature. Don't get mad, get even. Show us why Canonical made a great mistake in not choosing Wayland. Then maybe Canonical will return. They are practical people, not fighting silly flame wars.Mar 21, 2013
- > Since when is it a tantalizing idea to have one of anything in Linux?
Since you want 3rd party application developers (particularly game developers) to port their software to linux. Since you want graphics hardware manufacturers to write good drivers for linux. No big thing. Just the difference between being successful and not successful on the desktop.
> Then maybe Canonical will return. They are practical people
If this were true, they would have dropped upstart for systemd for the 13.04 release.Mar 21, 2013
The only reason we have games coming to Linux is Ubuntu. The only reason hardware manufacturers will be writing good drivers for Linux is Ubuntu. Not Wayland, Ubuntu. They do not care about Wayland, they already said they would not support it.
Why Ubuntu? Because Canonical is a reliable business partner and has a long term vision. Ubuntu has an excelent track record for delivering on time. Wayland just the opposite, it is more like Waitland.
You are not seriously suggesting we wait another few years for the people of Wayland to produce someting tangible but likely not what Ubuntu needs?
We have been waiting far to long. I am glad Canonical took matters in her own hands. Ubuntu will do it much quicker on her own and the end result will be better suited for what they want.
And who knows, maybe Ubuntu will do it in such a way that drivers are kept out of the display server, which would be a much better approach.
Open source is not monolithic development you want, it creates a free market. It offers choice. If Wayland wants to be viable it will have to proof herself by the product.
And it is wrong idea that more could be accomplished if all people work together on one project. We have seen that with Open Office. Since it was split, development goes much faster. Having all these in-fights between people with different ideas does not help progress.Mar 23, 2013
- But wayland/MIR would just be the display server. As an application developper I wouldn't even bother if it's wayland or MIR. The "single graphics API" would be OpenGL/ES. Or you just stick with some toolkit like GTK or QT. These toolkits (and maybe others) will have to be changed, yes. But honestly, when was the last time you did graphics programming using xlib directly?Mar 25, 2013
- Yes, I understand this. The current situation in the world of PC games as I understand it is that game developers develop for MS DirectX because the DirectX drivers supplied by graphics cards manufacturers are more robust than the GL drivers. And because most games are being developed for DirectX, the graphics cards manufacturers devote most of their resources to these drivers. A vicious circle. You can write OpenGL/ES programs all day long, but if the drivers are buggy, no one will be happy. It's precisely the driver issue which is of most concern here.Mar 29, 2013
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