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- Scott, that's much too long and involved a discussion for Google+.
Just a few thoughts: no one is or should be condemned for the biological structure of their mind (or body). But just as being biologically predisposed to an alcohol or drug addition should not be condemned, a person can't use that as an excuse to plunge head-first into alcohol and drugs.
You and Elisa believe (an act of faith) that homosexuality is innate. Others believe not. I believe the truth is it's neither wholly innate nor wholly environmental. But that's all irrelevant anyway.
It's not about being "cured" through prayer. Alcoholics and addicts are never "cured", they just learn make a choice to deal with their nature in a specific way.
Elisa, it's not about my sins or your sins or their sins. All people are part of the family of God. It's about our sins. Just as a truly loving family doesn't just turn a blind eye to Uncle Rory getting tanked and then trying to drive home, the loving family of God can't turn a blind eye and ignore the harm that these problems are doing. There are no private sins; they all affect the world around us.
The greatest commandment is to love the Lord your God, and the second is like it; that you love your neighbor as yourself. Christian love is active, and it is sacrifice. "This is love, that God so loved the world that he gave his only son", "greater love has no man than that he lay down his life for his friends".
Not "like" your neighbor; not "be kind to" you neighbor. Love your neighbor.
Read C. S. Lewis, "the Problem of Pain": “Love may, indeed, love the beloved when her beauty is lost: but not because it is lost. Love may forgive all infirmities and love still in spite of them: but Love cannot cease to will their removal. Love is more sensitive than hatred itself to every blemish in the beloved… Of all powers he forgives most, but he condones least: he is pleased with little, but demands all.” .
Which gets back to the original post. "Love the sinner, hate the sin".
Scott, Elisa, thank you for your posts here.May 1, 2012
Too bad that many churches here and now hate the sinners!!!
sighMay 1, 2012
- It sickens me to hear homosexuality compared to alcoholism. You may as well say that only whites are welcome in heaven. I'm going to give you the benefit of doubt and assume you don't understand the physiology of structures within the brain which determine sexual orientation. Please take the time to read up on the subject.May 1, 2012
- I'm sorry to hear that you took offense at my analogy; I attempted to choose a somewhat neutral one. Obviously I did not completely succeed.
My attempt was to note that there is a biological basis for alcoholism, and point to a statement that no one is or should be condemned for their biology.
I would be very willing to take time to read up on the subject; perhaps you could recommend some books?
I would like to repeat, once again, that I do NOT say that homosexuals should be condemned, or imply they are unwelcome in the church or in heaven.
My goal had been to openly discuss a complex and emotionally volatile issue. I had hoped I would do better. I offer my sincere apologies for my failure.May 1, 2012
- Not a judgement on anyone in this thread, I just wanted it noted that I don't consider homosexuality either a sin or inherently causing harm to anyone or anything. I realise others disagree and that's their perogative.May 1, 2012
- A view possibly responsible for more emotional and psychological abuse than any other. I hate to say it but it's duplicitous and fey beyond words.May 5, 2012