TL:DR - there was a LOT of extremist violence in Egypt in the '90s and at some point there were tens of thousands of people kept in prison so they physically ran out of space to keep them. They turned to Muslim scholars for help and they started religius rehabilitation. The whole thing was considered a success and lots of inmates were set free.
Scroll further to 2011 and later. The two main grups of extremists whose members were captured back then formed three political parties.
Their ideology is Islamism (Islam should guide social, political and personal life and implements Sharia law)
_"According to its manifesto, the party stands for a representative democracy with institutions guided by the principles of the Sharia, while rejecting any form of theocracy. Moreover, it favours a free economy and questions the size of the public sector. Among the party's ranks is Abbud al-Zumar, who was imprisoned for nearly twenty years for involvement in the assassination of the Egyptian president Anwar Sadat.
At a conference on 12 October 2012, in the Ain Shams neighborhood of Cairo, the group reaffirmed its support for Islamic Sharia in the new Egyptian constitution, and hinted that the group might be willing to resort to violence in order to secure it"_
Their ideology is Jihadism (armed fight against non-Muslims, somewhat funny considering they used to be called "peace and development party)
"The Party is in favour of putting the Camp David Accords to a public referendum, expanding Islamic banking, abolishing mixed-sex education in secondary schools, forming a cultural media council to monitor the Egyptian media, respecting private property, supports progressive taxation, and is in favour of setting a minimum and maximum wage in line with inflation"
Not much information about them but they are also based on Islamism
So, yeah, I'd consider the "religious rehabilitation" experiment largely a failure.
Then again over 80% of seats are occupied by Islamist and/or Jihadist parties it's probably not too much of a surprise.
I had a problem with your explanation as to how you got around the desire for empiricism....but you may have got to read that....I donno.
The problem this time wasnt that I didnt understand, it was that I did understand. Your sacrifice dictates that I cant have one of my wants - so in essence your world view is choosing my wants for me!
As to the science of kindness and patience - I just dont see that what you claimed was a consequence of not being patient or kind was particularly necessary. It may or may not be true for any individual circumstance, but certainly not something you could claim was necessarily a consequence in generality.
In as many cases as being patient and kind may help to achieve your goal, it could be just as often single minded selfishness could drive you to achieve it - kinda depends just what the goal is, and on the personality of the individual.
How about Isaac Newton as an example of someone who really wasnt very nice or very patient, but that probably helped him achieve what he did, because he was so driven and competitive. ( I would say his personal goal, beyond alchemy, was to be considered the greatest mind of his time - and I think he pretty much nailed that)
And I don't think he is an exception that proves a rule - its just an illustration of my point.
About Catholicism...this is the bit that I was editing when I deleted my post.
I do not consider myself anti theist. Provided ones views are not forced on anyone, I'm cool with that. If you are not asserting something as certainty that you cannot possibly know, then fine - I dont care if you have faith if it is acknowledged as being that.
An exception though was what your theist colleague was saying in your hangout... That kind of science knowledge denial really annoys me.
Which is where the wild variety of views even within Catholicism comes in.
I can listen to someone like Fr George Coyne, someone I admire and respect, and wonder just what he would have had to say to your colleague.
Actually I know eactly what he would have said....he would have just face palmed and said "have another beer".
It was science denial, pure and simple.
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