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David Edelstein's profile photoJavier Morales's profile photoRoger Whisler's profile photoKingston Hawke's profile photo
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They ALWAYS use people's mugshots, that's nothing new lol. No one is saying he's racist because he's unattractive, pretty sure it was the stalking and killing of a black kid that caused that.
 
He was definitely in the wrong.... the kid could have been the worst kid on the planet... but he was still un-armed... the 911 operator had asked him to stop following ....just nuts how anyone could think that a 17 year old kid deserved that ...Not sure if he is/was racist, but he's guilty of manslaughter for sure
 
That's not manslaughter. That's 2nd degree murder. And they need to just ban hand guns all together. Way more harm than help.
 
In Florida, manslaughter, defined as: The killing of a human being by the act, procurement, or culpable negligence of another, without lawful justification according to the provisions of chapter 776 and in cases in which such killing shall not be excusable homicide or murder . . . is a second degree felony punishable by up to 15 years in state prison regardless of whether the act may have been intentional or not. If manslaughter is committed upon a child via culpable negligence under FL statute 827.03(3), then the crime is aggravated manslaughter of a child which is a first degree felony punishable by up to 30 years in state prison.
 
By Florida law it's manslaughter of a child (u17) ...
I don't agree that we should ban guns as this does help us in many ways ( in my opinion ) and is outlined in our country's bill of rights. Don't think criminal acts ( like Zimmermans ) should be the catalyst for change....
 
The media has blown this all out of proportion! The story just gets more confusing and twisted as the days past so I just stopped paying attention
 
I don't know about Florida law specifically, but manslaughter refers to crimes of passion. This wasn't that, this was a hate crime in its truest form. He stalked an unarmed boy, made racial remarks, mounted, and then shot him in the chest. It's very close to be 1st degree murder honestly. And this isn't being too blown up. If this story scares just one racist person out of doing the same thing in the future it will have been worth it.

And what exactly are handguns good for that isn't created by the presence of other handguns, or could be accomplished with a taser? 
 
i don't think this is being blown out proportion and I don't know if the act was racial... What i do see ( just my thought ) is that this fellow (Zimmerman) was a loose cannon and definitely should have listened to the 911 operator when told not to follow the kid. This would not have happened then ( and did not need to happen ). Now as a person with intimate knowledge of the legalities within Florida, this guy is certainly going to do some serious time. I imagine and speculate that he'll be indicted within 7-10 days and a trial by jury is not going to bode well for him ( and shouldn't ), I would speculate he'll be sentanced under Florida manslaughter crimes and be facing beween 10-17 years.
 
Now guns also serve as deterrents against political upheaval and allow citizens to protect themselves; criminals will always find away regardless.
Perhaps, we should have some sort of legislation that prohibits hi-caliber fire arms, assault weapons and /or offensive weapons from entering our country?
Do I know how to regulate? No … But, I do know that my family immigrated to the US close to 60 years ago and were victimized by armed soldiers and did not
Have the weapons to fend off the attacks/military coups ( this is what’s happened historically all over the world ; Eu, Africa, Asia, Latam and the Caribbean )
Gun control is definitely a difficult topic as we all like minded folks can’t fathom the killing of a child ..
 
I think (complete speculation) that he suggested manslaughter because it's easier to get and they didn't have a lot of evidence at the time. But with as much attention as it's received, and all the evidence that has come out (the boy's screams while being assaulted were recorded by a neighbor). No way they should or will settle for manslaughter. And I know people like to pretend racism doesn't exist, but when you're recorded referring to the kid as "koon" and "they", race is obviously an issue.

As far as handguns, I agree that it's unlikely that there would be a way to make hand guns completely disappear. But if we could make 95% of them, that'd be a great improvement. You put a billion dollars towards finding an alternative to handguns and we'd have an answer so fast that cops wouldn't even need to carry them. But our country (and most others) doesn't value individual life.
 
I don't think it's possible to get any other conviction aside from a mansalughter conviction for this act, In Florida, a person is guilty of first degree murder when it is perpetrated from a premeditated design to result in the death of a human being. A person is also guilty of first degree murder if they cause the death of any individual during the commission of a predicate felony regardless of actual intent or premeditation. Now where did you hear this audio tape? i've not heard that; actually the first time i've heard this mentioned. Can you send me a web address to a page if you know where it's at. I think it's naive to think racism doesn't exist.... it certainly does.... whether white vs Black , Black vs Hispanic , Hispanic vs Asian and so on .... but it doen't tak much more than calm , logical folks having REAL dialogue and trying to understand other folks perspectives.... A white person hasnt walked in a black person's shoes, but a black person hasnt walked in a white person's shoes either.... sometimes perspective and true discussion can bring things to light...
 
+Javier Morales +Kingston Hawke +Alex Cazeau Javier, I agree with just about 99% of what you're saying, and it is the lack of dispassionate analysis--like yours--that prompted me to create this picture.

LIke a lot of things in life, this case is messy. It's certainly much easier to simplify, categorize, and demonize.

What's clear--regardless of the outcome of this case--is that our perspectives are necessarily shaped by how we have experienced the world. That was the double entendre of "Things are always simpler in black and white."
 
Javier... you're describing 1st degree murder, I said 2nd degree specifically because you don't need premeditation for it to be 2nd degree. The line between 2nd degree murder and manslaughter is whether he was rationally "riled up" for lack of a better term. When you examine the evidence it's clear that he wasn't. When it was just his story, you couldn't prove that. But now that there are witnesses coming forward that say that he mounted the child before shooting him, and a recording of the kid crying for help (click the youtube link to listen yourself) it's clear that that wasn't the case.

http://globalgrind.com/node/828331

Trayvon Martin 911 Tape Screaming "Help"

David... What exactly is messy about this case? He saw a black kid in a hoody on public property and called the cops on him. The cops told him to leave it alone, he instead followed and refereed to the kid using a racial slur. He confronts the kid who is half his size and unarmed, mounts him, and then shoots him in the chest. I understand the "stand our ground" law as ridiculous as it is, but between him hunting the kid down, and mounting him I don't see how that can apply.
 
That kid that's "half his size" is six feet three inches tall. 
 
Yeah, he was also 150 lbs. About 50 less than Zimmerman. 
 
Zimmerman five feet nine inches tall and 170 pounds. 
 
I'm not going to argue about the weight. I've read about 5 different weights listed for him (including the 170 that his best friend gave), and I've watched the surveillance footage. There's not enough to say specifically what he weighed, but what is clear is that he was significantly larger than Trayvon, and armed. Now I get that you're Mr. Conservative white man, but get real. If this was black on black, or white on white, you know you'd be saying there is more than enough evidence to hang Zimmerman. Even his self-defense story has been blown between the eye-witness accounts, and the new footage of him at the police station without a mark on him.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/29/george-zimmerman-video-outrage-where-are-injuries-from-travyon-fight.html
 
Kingston.. I was actually citing Florida's manslaughter law (which is in the 2nd degree) ; text book definition and yes I did study law. No sense in debating an opinion of what the law is vs. Factually what the letter of the law is. I summarized 1st degree murder as you mentioned previously that he could or should be prosecuted for a capital offense. The one witness is a pre-teen who @ this point in nameless ( for his/her protection ) and he stated a story that supported Zimmerman's claim. I for one don't agree with the argument as an unarmed kid was shot and killed. But again no sense debating the applicable law in Florida as it's clear to the folks that will try him in court (potentially)... Event does just stink.. So we shouldn't be wrapped up on this point, rather that an unarmed youth was shot and killed... (My opinion solely)
 
Don't take my comments as a statement of guilt or innocence mr. Kingston Hawke. Based on a comment about weight, you have already concluded that I think Zimmerman is innocent, and that I am conservative. The only thing that you know for sure about me is that I'm white. That assuming I have posted my own picture, which I have. You on the other hand seem to have, with out evidence, come to the conclusion that I in fact think that Zimmerman is innocent, and that I'm a conservative, yet there is no evidence to support either claim. Which is exactly my point. We have yet to hear the "real" evidence regarding this terrible tragedy. So you know where I stand, let me say this, I think charges, and an arrest, should have been made the very night the shooting occurred. Unfortunately, as the police have done neither, they must now maintain their need to justify their actions of not making an arrest. As far as guilt or innocence goes, neither you or I are qualified to make the determination, as we were not there. We can only hope that the "real" evidence will in fact be determined, and justice served. As for me being conservative, I'll just leave that to your imagination. Good luck. 
 
Roger... You are aware that your profile is public right? I didn't call you "Mr. Conservative" because you are white, nice try though. Oh yeah, and I didn't conclude that you think Zimmerman is innocent, I assumed that you felt that there weren't enough facts to form a preliminary opinion yet... pretty sure that assumption was right on the money. Or maybe you're also unaware of what the word "conservative" means. Smh

Javier... The witness you are referring to is a 13 year old boy named Austin Brown who wanted to be referred to as "John" at the time in an effort to stay anonymous. People are saying that his story corroborates Zimmerman's because that's what the cops reported. But if you listen to the police call, or hear what the witness' own family have to say, it's the complete opposite.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/28/10909475-witness-mom-says-police-told-her-trayvon-martin-shooting-wasnt-self-defense
 
Kingston, you're a funny guy. Yes I'm well aware that my profile is public. After all, I'm the one that put it there. The fact that you can garner facts from a nebulous google profile like mine, and then call me "Mr. Conservative", is hilarious. If that's all it takes, then I assume you are conservative as well. 
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