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Here's #Mir  up and running on my +System76 Bonobo Extreme using the #Nouveau  driver. 

The tell? Two mouse cursors. lol!
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42 comments
 
+Chris Fisher had the same expression but the community told me about the bug, it's not a big deal unless you use an external mouse
 
Let us know your experience running Mir =)
 
So is this the end of Arch on your machine?
 
Thats not running on Mir. Its running on XMir. Not exactly the same thing! 

I believe the other cursor is there on purpose to show you that its successfully running on xmir and not just on x11. 
 
Chris where did you find the 13.10 image? I can't find it. I have been looking for the past hour. 
 
just can not get it working on my machene. im running 13.10. it could be due to the fact that i have quite an old computer? ah well i'll keep trying...
 
sigh So, you are running x11 (x.org if you wish), not Mir.

What Mir is doing is providing a single full screen texture ... within which an x11 session is doing EVERYTHING ELSE. Which means Mir is doing nothing, for all intents and purposes.

This is a most trivial of things to accomplish and speaks nothing to the fit, finish or design readiness of Mir.

That they can't even get it right with two cursors says it all. XWayland gets that right, but why would you bother putting that on your system? I mean, it's only the more mature, more supported option.

My favorite is how at least one "journalist" said that the second cursor was there on purpose so you knew Mir was running. What rubbish.

I am guessing that posting about Wayland is too difficult, and propping up the fanboi-isitic Ubuntu is fun .. but maybe you should think about what is best in the long run for free software.

And by "maybe" I mean "you should".
 
+Aaron Seigo he posted a screenshot and a couple of sentences to his personal g+ page, is that propping up ubuntu?
 
+christopher fujino Yes, since Mir is directly tied to Ubuntu and as evidenced by your rapid response Chris' postings have a following.

+Joshua Strobl Respond to the content, or don't bother.
 
+Aaron Seigo Interesting you're saying "respond to the content", when you were blowing things completely out of proportion, making a big deal out of a completely innocent image and comment. Really man, take a chill pill.
 
+Joshua Strobl I responded to the  content (as I suggested to you). You on the other hand suggested I was drunk, not  bothering to address anything I said. Do you see the difference?

Now ... I have read a few postings by respected F/OSS commentators in the last 48 hours stating (paraphrasing) "I've tried Mir, here it is, it's working!" when what they are trying is X11 in a full screen texture provided by  Mir. That is not a quibble, that is a critical fact.

I'd like Free software developers and users to be accurately informed so that decisions can be made in the best interests of Free software.

You?
 
+Aaron Seigo i don't think this post is pro-mir nor con-mir, i think +Chris Fisher just finds it amusing there are two cursors. i can understand your concerns about "commentators" and "journalists" writing erroneous articles about new open source technology, but this post wasn't a canonical endorsement.
 
+Dyrver Eriksson I've  never said it isn't an option; I've merely asked for full and accurate representation. I am not saying this with KWin in mind whatsoever (or any of the other Wayland related technologies out there).

Is it, in your mind, too much to expect reasonably fully accurate reviews of technology?

Consider that this is an area of technology that stands to impact Free software on the client significantly.

As with Joshua above,  you're not addressing the content of what I wrote whatsoever. I'd welcome such a discussion.
 
+christopher fujino I've been around this block a few times before, and here's how it works: people with followings write about a controversial technology in a net-positive manner and it washes out the controversy .. people then adjust to / adopt that positioning, regardless of the reality of the technology.

As with the others in this thread, I note you aren't addressing the content of what I wrote but the manner in which it was written. Can we address the content of what I wrote? I'm willing to accept I'm the worst  / most inept / etc person ever if you'd just do that :)
 
+Aaron Seigo Maybe people would take you seriously if you would be a bit more civil and anywhere close to reality. You seem to be following +Chris Fisher so why the heck don't you acknowledge the post where he shows how Mir blatantly fails to work on his Ati setup?
Any person with any reading comprehension can gather from this post nothing but a screenshot of and the statement that Mir is running, which it has to even if XMir is involved and does all the heavy lifting.
This is +Chris Fisher's personal G+ page, none of this is any kind of "journalistic" exploration of the whole topic yet, that would be tomorrow's LAS and if +Chris Fisher were to wave an Ubuntu banner and say Mir is dope and all others can go home, you might have a point.
As it stands you are just being a dick on the Internet and we don't need another one of those.
I considered you a smart and likable man but if you keep doubling down on being a massive butt, I will change my mind, frankly, I'm already in the process of doing that.
 
+Stephan Lanfermann "you would be a bit more civil"

Can you please quote me verbatim where I was not civil? Thanks.

"why the heck don't you acknowledge the post where he shows how Mir blatantly fails to work on his Ati setup?"

Because I have no quibble with the accuracy of it.

Now, speaking of civility:

"Any person with any reading comprehension"
....
"you are just being a dick"

It seems you are not one to lecture others on civility.

So instead, can you respond to the content of what I wrote so we can get on to the  business of rational discourse? Thanks.

+christopher fujino "i agree with pretty much everything you're saying about mir, wayland, and canonical."

Fair enough ...
 
+Aaron Seigo So you are the kind of person that will willfully ignore the part where a person highlights the negative aspects of something you have a critical opinion about but the moment they don't even talk positively about it but just show a matter of fact situation without making any judgement calls your are all in their face and accuse them of being biased/a fanboy (That was the uncivil part btw.)? This is not how a proper discussion works ever, this is the MO of a troll and we shall not feed those.

Come back and criticize when actual judgement calls have been made in tomorrows LAS and you feel those were undue. As it stands nothing of value has been produced in this sorry excuse for a discussion as its roots lie firmly in the realm of willful ignorance.

End of THIS.
 
+Aaron Seigo I get that you're annoyed by the large amount of wang sucking the general press does around Mir, which at this point is basically a one trick pony. 

Though if you knew what my commentary was going to be tomorrow, you'd see how you kinda jumped the gun here. 

I've read just about everything you've written publicly about Mir, and generally track along the same lines. I am a bit more willing to let them give it a go, and see how things turn out.

But from a big picture, it seems bleek, and the timing is bad as the rest of Linux seems to be coming closer together more then ever. 

The whole reason I mentioned the two mouse cursors is it kinda highlights what a hack it is.

But it dosen't mean I should ignore it. I strive to have an informed opinion when I can.

And while it sucks for the developers, I as an end user am happy to see a lot of attention and passion around this topic.
 
+Stephan Lanfermann "accuse them of being biased/a fanboy "

Please go back and read what I actually wrote, which was:

" propping up the fanboi-isitic Ubuntu "

I never said Chris was being a fanboi, but Ubuntu was "fanboi-istic". The problem with posts such as Chris' is that Ubuntu has a following that gloms on to anything that seems in favor of it, regardless of facts that may underlay the issues at hand.

So .. no, I didn't accuse Chris of being a fanboi. His personal position is beside the point. Factual integrity of the public observations of pundits and observers is.

"That was the uncivil part btw."

Aha.. So you misread something, figured I was being uncivil as a result and so called me a dick in public. Neat.

Was there something else you found in what I wrote that was uncivil?

"Come back and criticize when actual judgement calls have been made in tomorrows LAS"

If LAS was amazingly critical of Mir, this posting (along with others like it in the same time period) would still be held up by  Ubuntu fanbois in future. I say that confidently as that is what has occurred in the past.

You have mistaken where my concerns lay.
 
+Chris Fisher What has been evident in the past is that regardless of any eventual full analysis that may be forthcoming, when such statements are made they are glommed onto by certain groups as validation of their existing opinions, even if future analysis says otherwise.

Providing a dully factual and consistent response is the one thing that seems to prevent that.

Personally, I'd enjoy having another option. After all, it's not like I'm actively searching for inventive ways to get people to call me a dick ;) If you could suggest a strategy that has proven to create an accurate view of technical matters in such cases, I am all ears.
 
+Aaron Seigo Well I would agree that you're responses in other areas/threads have helped me consider multiple viewpoints, so I'd say I'm proof postive of your basic idea.

Though - what seems to be the real challange is avoiding a rep of someone who's hounding everyone that talks about Mir. 

This issues Mir introudces though is one of the larger, long-term impacting "problems" the community is chewing on right now.  But most the discussion is not going very deep.
 
The thing that scares me most about the whole Mir & Wayland situation is that we finally have amazing driver support from all the major GPU manufacturers and some of them are simple going to now chose which ever display server that has more market share.

That and I've seen talks from the Wayland developers about it's technical capabilities and why we need it. They make a very well reasoned argument which for the most part I agree with. I have yet to see this from Mir and by the looks of things at the moment anything other than Unity will always be simply X.org in a window which I think we can all agree is just a bit silly.
 
+Chris Fisher   did post this as a journalist simply because he is one and this is a public post from him, also +Aaron Seigo   you let them pull you into total derailment of the (your own) discussion, shame on you.  On the other hand it is good to know what exactly is going on with mir/xmir.  Honestly I feel that I am more informed with Aaron 's first comment, however the resulting war could have been avoided.  Either way no one is in the wrong here... other than, of course, the you said/he said part. (though it was amusing)
 
I'm just sitting here, happy with my xorg install. 
 
I think some people are talking this topic too seriously. Any forward progress towards a new display server is news worthy and excitement worthy. At least with mir we have some idea of a eta and some basic example of the technology that we can try right now. 
 
>>The thing that scares me most about the whole Mir & Wayland situation is that we finally have amazing driver support from all the major GPU manufacturers and some of them are simple going to now chose which ever display server that has more market share.<<

For some time I'm not worried so much about support from gpu manufacturers.  I read about this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EGL_%28OpenGL%29 It seems that there may be so that single driver will support Wayland AND Mir. If I'm wrong, please, someone correct me.

That doesn't mean I like the Mir situation.
Tim JP
 
+Art Mazur The Gnome Shell and KDE roadmaps for Wayland are pretty clear. You can try wayland if you want aswell.  Either just install wayland and weston or look at some other projects like the Maui Desktop, Solus OS (+Ikey Doherty), KDE 4.11 Beta or some of the native wayland ports like MPlayer, Doom 3 and the toolkit demos etc.
 
+Tim JP by road map of mean more of an eta. Its been basically in when it's done status for about five years. 
 
I agree with the critisism's of mir. Mir's marketing arm seems to far overshadow what it can actually do. I see all kinds of news saying stuff like "zomg ubuntu 13.10 using mir by default" and then all kinds of silly comments saying that mir is awesome and wayland is vaporware, when the actual fact is mir does almost nothing, and ubuntu using mir "as default" is just running X11 on top of mir, with X still doing 95% of the work. Ubuntu "using it by default" gives a false appearence that mir will be "ready" quicker than wayland and that it is further along, when in reality thats not really the case.

Its also worth mentioning mir is build on top of a lot of upstream work, without the work done by wayland and other upstream projects (xwayland, egl drivers etc...) mir wouldn't even to be able to do the little it does now.
 
+Tim JP
Canonical didn't do a shred of work on the wayland project. They made no commits, they didn't even bother contacting any of the wayland developers about any of their concerns/needs.

Just saying "its a high priority" doesn't mean crap if you don't actually do anything about it... Canonical sat on their hands, made no effort to contact wayland devs or contribute any code and then were dissatisfied that it "wasn't happening fast enough".
 
one is software cursor, the other is the hardware cursor. 
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